December 6, 2021 – On today’s podcast we welcome special guest, LOOP Industries Founder and CEO, Daniel Solomita. Loop Industries takes waste PET plastic and polyester fiber — which cannot be conventionally recycled — and turns them into high value materials.
On the show, Daniel discusses:
- The sustainability mission at the heart of LOOP
- Details around the process to generate PET plastic from recycled content
- The long term thesis behind plastics recycling
- His comments on short seller Hindenburg Research’s negative report on LOOP
- And more
Welcome investors to The Absolute Return Podcast. Your source for stock market analysis, global macro musings and hedge fund investment strategies, your hosts, Julian Klymochko, and Michael Kesslering aim to bring you the knowledge and analysis you need to become a more intelligent and wealthier investor. This episode is brought to you by Accelerate Financial Technologies. Accelerate because performance matters. Find out more at accelerateshares.com.
Julian Klymochko: Excited to have Daniel all the way from Montreal, Quebec, Canada, across the country from us, but I’m sure it’s just as cold there, winter season is upon us in Canada. So, Daniel, welcome to the show. I wanted to start off by getting into the history of Loop industries. Specifically, you founded it in 2014 with a mission to accelerate the world’s shift towards sustainable plastic and away from our dependence on fossil fuels. Why is this mission important to you?
Daniel Solomita: Thank you very much, guys. Pleasure to be with you guys. I mean, for me, it was really exciting. I’m a computer engineering, worked at Bell Canada, CGI for 12 years before leaving there. I knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur, wanted to do something in the environmental space. I saw that as a huge opportunity. And so, when I left Bell, I went to start a landfill remediation project in Greenwood, South Carolina.
Julian Klymochko: Okay.
Daniel Solomita: Where we were digging up an industrial landfill that accompany [Inaudible 00:01:08] in the 1970s had dumped 40 million pounds of Nylon 66 fiber in the ground.
Julian Klymochko: Doesn’t sound good.
Daniel Solomita: So just millions of pounds of huge spaghetti string. And what they did is they basically created this landfill right in the back of the facility. So, all of their scrap and all of their waste. For years, they were just piling it up outside in their backyard. And the laws in South Carolina changed where like in the 1980s, you couldn’t keep things above ground anymore. So, what these companies did is, they just dug a big hole, dumped it in the ground and then covered it with dirt. So, you know, you dig about a foot and a half under the earth and it was this huge pile of Nylon 66 fiber. And so, I took over that project, we invented a little rudimentary technology to clean up the fibers. I don’t know if you’ve ever been to South Carolina, but the dirt there was like a really thick red clay. So just imagine all these spaghetti strings tangled with red clay. So very difficult to get the red clay off of it. And so, we bought some equipment from the pulp and paper industry at Tornado Pulper, which was like a big three-foot rotor stator.
And we used to fill the tank with water, dump in the Nylon 66 fibers. And then the rotor stator used to shred it and loosen up the dirt. So, the clay would stay with the water and the solid would be pumped out after. And we started selling that material off to the compounding industry, where they were using it, doing mechanical recycling, and going back into the automotive industry. So that’s how I got interested in sustainability. And I saw that there’s an opportunity when you have an opportunity to take waste and be able to transform it. Mildly transforming it, you can create value out of something that has no value. And so that’s kind of how I thought about this. During that time, I met chemist who had the idea for what we called loop gen one technology, which is a hydrolysis-based technology that we worked on from 2014 until sometime like end of 2017, mid 2018, we started switching over to our gen two, which is what we’re commercializing today. And so that chemist had the idea. So, we started working together on what he thought about, can we actually apply that into an industrial technology, our gen one technology, great technology, good quality. When you’re scaling up technologies, you kind of see where there could be more expensive costs or things. And so that’s when we reinvented the technology to be our gen two technology.
Julian Klymochko: So, from that, you kind of cut your teeth doing this, you know, big recycling project. How did you come up with the idea for Loop? I suppose there was this gen one technology, but since then, how did it progress to becoming ultimately a publicly traded company?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, great question. So, when we started Loop, it was a very small, you know, we started off as a really small project and kind of going from lab, lab scale. And so, when we needed to raise money to go from lab to a pilot plant, that’s where we needed to find investors to put up some money. We needed about $3 million to do that. And so, you know, the finance world investing, finding investors, I had the least amount of knowledge possible at any of those types of things. I really didn’t know how to do that. So just went to different meetings, meeting different people over and over again. And eventually probably met with hundreds of people in Canada, couldn’t find anybody that wanted to invest in the project or to believe that us. So, I met these guys out of California who through their network said, hey, we can help you raise the money, but to be able to do that, we need you to do this, you know, reverse merger into an OTC to become a public company on the junior markets.
And so, I weighed all my options. I really didn’t have any other options to raise the capital. And so that’s how we became a public company initially listing on the OTC markets in the summer of 2015. And then we decided to go up from 2015 in 2017, we were kind of like in no man’s land on the OTC markets because if you’re public, but you’re not really public. The credibility is not there. And so, our attorneys at the time, Wilson Sonsini said, hey, if you’re going to be a public company, you know, you should move up and become and go to the NASDAQ. And so that’s what we did. We filed the paperwork, we qualified for the NASDAQ. So that’s how we became a U.S. company, even though, you know, mainly Canadian based, all of our employees are here in Montreal.
Julian Klymochko: It’s certainly adds to the credibility of the story being a NASDAQ list. And now I wanted to put some numbers in front of our audience, specifically with respect to the long-term thesis behind plastics recycling, can you offer up the kind of business opportunity in terms of size of this market?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, so the market is humongous. So, what Loop does is, we break down waste PET plastic and polyester fiber into their base, petrochemical, monomers, DMT, and MEG. We purify that back to their purest form. And then we build that back up into a brand-new [Inaudible 00:06:19] plastic. So, if you think about Loop, we’re actually a petrochemical manufacturing company because we manufactured by metaphoric dolly, DMT, which is a white powder. Everyone else in the world that manufacturers VMT starts from crude oil.
Julian Klymochko: Right.
Daniel Solomita: So, when you’re going from crude oil to gasoline, there’s a byproduct of xylene. Xylene is processed to make DMT. The other product we produce is Meg, which is at clear oily liquid starts off as natural gas, goes through an ethylene cracker to make Meg. So, everyone else that manufacturers those two products start with fossil fuels. We manufactured the exact same two products, but we start with the waste plastic and we break it down into those molecules, purified them and build them back up. So, it’s really the essence of the circular economy. So today the PET and polyester market is about 85 million metric tons per year. About 65% goes into the fiber. So polyester fiber for textiles, clothing, running shoes, that type of stuff, and 35% goes into packaging. Out of the 35, 25 of the 35 is probably water bottles, soda bottles, you know, ketchup, mayonnaise type of containers. And then that other 10% is other types of packaging. You know, salad trays, fruit cups, that type of stuff. So those really the markets, it’s about a $180 million per year addressable market right now, so the market is huge. So, the recycling industry needs technology to be overcome its challenges, right. Today cycling is not very efficient because besides a clean, clear water bottle that can be recycled today.
Most of those water bottles get turned into fibers. So, the largest bottle recycler in North America is Mohawk Carpets down in Dalton, Georgia, where they’re buying bottles up and down the Northeast United States and Canada, and in Dalton, Georgia turning those water bottles into carpet fiber. And so, they’re blending in their carpets about a 25% recycled content in carpets. So, besides the water bottle, nothing else can really be efficiently recycled because there’s limitations to mechanical recycling. And that’s where chemical recycling steps in. What loop does is depolymerization. So, we don’t care if there’s colors, contamination, other plastics, you know, rocks, glass, ketchup, mayonnaise, anything that’s in there. Our technology only specifically breaks down to PET and polyester and everything else gets filtered out of the process. So, we can really solve a problem where we can now increase the amount of materials that can be recycled and everything we produce is virgin quality, food grade plastic that can go into water bottles of the highest purity.
I don’t know if you guys saw recently, we launched a first commercial production with Evian, the French a water bottle company who for me is, you know, the global standard for water that, you know, the best in the world, purity wise. And it’s all bottled in one place in the French alps and, you know, distributed around the world. And so, we launched a product with them. So, it’s going to be the first time that there’s ever going to be a hundred percent recycled content, a water bottle produced by chemical recycling sold commercially on the market. That’s the first time ever. And it’s coming through our facility here in Montreal, Quebec. So that’s the premise. What we give to the brand owners is the highest quality plastic coming from a recycled source. So, what’s really driving the market. To get back to your question, what’s driving the market is more and more governments now are taking the onus of recycling instead of having the taxpayers pay for it.
Because today, part of our taxes is for, you know, those blue bins and the trucks to come and pick up our blue bins, the sort sortation sector. Right now, taxpayers are paying for it. And the municipalities are fed up with the taxpayer paying for it. They want to put the onus on the brand owners, the companies that are making money, selling us those products. Those are the ones that are becoming responsible for what happens to the package at the end of its life. So, in Europe, there’s tons of regulation going on about, you know, governments putting in regulation where you have to have a minimum percentage of recycled content in your packaging. Canada came out by 2030, you have to have 50% recycled content in your package by 2030. So, every water bottle, soda bottle, ketchup, mayonnaise, everything that’s made. The packaging has to be 50% recycled content.
So now that stimulates the marketplace and it forces the brand owners to move away from petroleum-based plastics and to create a market for that recycled plastic so that the value of the recycled plastic gets higher, and it stimulates that growth. Same thing in Asia and other parts of the world. So, there’s a lot of exciting trends. Not only are the brands know, they need to know some, they need to do something because they’re being targeted as the biggest polluters in the world, rightly or wrongly, the water bottle is a symbol of pollution. So, the brand owners know they need to do something and now the governments are really mandating stuff. And so, Loop plants are kind of like an infrastructure project because different countries around the world are asking us to start looking at their country as a potential spot for the Loop, the Loop plants, because they need to get more recycling and to have all of those materials that today cannot be recycled to have a home for them, and to be able to recycle
Julian Klymochko: That makes a lot of sense in terms of putting the onus on the brands, just to further increase recycling and this chemical recycling process. It makes a lot of sense. I mean, everyone knows that these piles of plastic junk in the oceans, basically islands of them. And it’s a huge problem. So, I’m not surprised to see governments and companies effectively being forced to do something about it. So, it’s a good feel, good story. I did want to get more into the chemical recycling. So, you have a process to generate this PET plastic and polyester fiber made from 100% recycled content. Can you get into, you know, a quick two minutes on how that process works, how the technology works?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, sure. So, like I said, it deals with two types of plastics, PET plastic, which is the number one, use plastic for packaging. So, water bottles, soda bottles, you know, fruit cups, all that type of material, solid [Inaudible 00:12:37] when you go buy a takeout, salad tray and you know, shampoo, soap containers and polyester fiber. So polyester fiber for carpets and clothing, textile industry. So that’s the category of plastics that our technology will break down. And if you think about any one of those products, either a polyester shirt or a water bottle, if you break it down to the molecular level, you could just simply think of it as a DMT molecule attached to a Meg molecule, then you have another DMT molecule attached to another Meg molecule, another DMT, another Meg. And that chain is what gives plastic it’s strength. So today all of those products start with fossil fuels.
Like I mentioned earlier, the DMT and Meg come from fossil fuels. So, what Loop technology does is, that low temperature we go in and we cut the bond, our catalyst access, a big pair of scissors and cuts the bond. That’s holding those two petrol chemicals together and releases them in their singular form. Once they’re released in, they’re singular form, all of the other like color additives, dyes, any other contaminants, other than PET or polyester. So, you can have like a typical water bottle, you’ll have three or four different materials or construction, typical clothing, you know, you’ll have a polyester fiber, but then you’ll have mixed with cotton. You’ll have nylon and you’ll have a zipper, buttons, all those different materials of construction pose, a lot of challenges to traditional recycling. So, because we only attack the PET and polyester. Everything else stays whole, and we just filter it out of the process.
So that’s the way we can handle materials that cannot be recycled today. Once we break it down, we purify it simply through distillation columns, which is pretty common in the food and chemical industry to purify things with distillation columns, we’ve purified the DMT and the Meg back to their purest form. And then we recombine it into brand new plastic, ready to be turned into a new polyester fiber or a water bottle. So, I could take an old polyester carpet that you’re going to throw in the garbage and turn that to a water bottle for, let’s say Evian one of our customers. That’s really the power of Loop technology.
Julian Klymochko: And how does this technology compare to anything else out there? You know, obviously plastic recycling has been around for a while. What differentiates your technology?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, so a great question. So today, and what’s been around for a while is mechanical recycling.
Julian Klymochko: Right.
Daniel Solomita: Mechanical recycling, and what they do? It’s all they do is, they take a water bottle, they wash it, they take off the cap, they take off the label, it’s a very inefficient process and they just take it, they shred it, and then they melted into smaller little particles, PET resin before getting turned into a final product, looks like little grains of rice. So, their pellets. And so, what they do is, they just take a clean clear plastic, and they turn it into those pellets, and then they reuse the pellets. Problem is, they can’t handle any type of contamination. They don’t purify the product at all. It actually degrades in quality. So, if you look at a bottle made with recycled content or virgin, we’ll see the virgin one is nice and crisp and clear where the other one is usually dark in color or gray and they have to put in dye, so it doesn’t look very good. It’s not very appealing.
But that only solves the problem for water bottles, nothing else, right? And I said, most of those water bottles get turned into carpets by Shaw & Mohawk Carpets. And so, you need to find the technology. So, Loop technology and the chemical recycling can take any form of the polyester, any form of PET. Because we break it down to the molecular level. Now chemicals we’re recycling has been around since the 1960s. It’s never been successfully done on that commercial scale because every single other technology out there trying to do something similar uses high heat and high pressure to be able to break down the plastic. So, what they do is, they take the plastic and they put it down at, let’s say 250 to 300 degrees Celsius with an enormous amount of pressure to break the molecules down, right.
To break it apart. That’s the problem because when you’re using a lot of high heat and high pressure to break it apart, it’s like slamming it with a sledgehammer. So, if you have other plastics in there, each plastic has its own starting points. So, if you have, let’s say PVC contamination, that’s a great example. PVC and PET are very difficult to differentiate each other. So, if you have PVC in your PET stream and you’re smashing you with a sledgehammer, you’re going to release chlorine gas. Because that’s one of the components that make of it, which is obviously a poisonous gas you don’t want to have to deal with it. So, by hitting it with heat and pressure, any other contaminants in your feed stock are going to be broken down as well. And it’s spoiled your [Inaudible 00:17:20] You can’t have a purity of the output.
So that’s been the biggest challenge, the high heat and high pressure, because at the end of the day, we’re dealing with garbage, right? The waste that we’re dealing with, it’s garbage. You’re going to find all kinds of crazy stuff in there. Rocks, glass, ketchup, mayonnaise, who knows what you’re going to get in there. So, if you have to be very careful that you can’t have certain products in there, it’s never going to work. So, what Loop has done and what’s different about what Look does that’s never been done before is, how do we break that molecule apart at low temperature? So, everything we do is that low industrial temperature. Below 85 degrees Celsius because at those temperatures, none of those other contaminants get broken down, they stay whole and we just filter it out of the process. So that’s the genius of our Loops technology is being able to be polymerized the PET at mold temperature.
Michael Kesslering: Yeah, thank you very much for taking us through the recycling process. It’s really interesting. And there’s obviously like the obvious points on why we need recycling that Julian mentioned, and that you’ve mentioned, but when you look at it and comparing, because you mentioned that the traditional way to make these products, the DMT and Meg is through petrochemicals. How does the cost differ right now with your process versus the petrochemical process? And what’s the trend of that moving forward?
Daniel Solomita: The cost of the pure petrochemical companies. The cost depends on the price of oil. At the end of the day, the price of oil or the price of natural gas drive the cost of commercial BMT and Meg and Virgin petroleum-based plastic. It’s a direct correlation, right? There’s also the supply and demand obviously by the customers and the marketplace, but mostly that’s what it’s driven by. Whereas for us, it’s different drivers. So, we completely decouple all of our pricing from fossil fuels. So, we actually use the waste plastic as a starting point for our pricing formula. So, if the waste plastic goes up, then our price goes up, plastic goes down, our price goes down because we believe with all of the government regulation, with everything that’s happening and the brand owners needing to have more sustainability, that price of the raw material is going to continue going up. But we’ll capture that on the upside. But I’d say we’re very competitive with the petrochemical industry, except we have a different model. Petrochemical industry is very high volume, big plants, lower margin, we’re smaller plants, smaller capacity, higher margin. So that’s kind of the way you balance it out.
Julian Klymochko: I did want to get into the plant level economics because you didn’t mention, you know, they’re smaller in nature and better profitability reading through your investor presentation. You have this, you call it the infinite Loop manufacturing facility. Can you describe how that works and give some numbers with respect to the estimated economics it?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, so the infinite Loop is really the solution that I designed to be able to go in one facility, take waste plastic, break it down into the monomers, purify the monomers, and then build it up into a brand-new piece of plastic. It combines Loop front end technology to go from the waste plastic to the DMT and the Meg. And then we use relicensed chem tech and vistas technology. So, vistas is one of the pioneers in PET, it’s owned by the Koch family, so Koch Industrial Solutions.
Julian Klymochko: Yep.
Daniel Solomita: And so, they have the technology that goes into making PET plastic, it’s a tried-and-true technology. It’s been around for over 60 years, they have over 175 plants running around the world using their technology. So, I didn’t need to reinvent how to make the PET. I had to reinvent how to make the petrochemicals. And so that’s where those infinite Loop combined their technology and our technology all into one facility.
So that’s kind of how we built that. The initial capacity is 70,000 tons per facility. That’s where we’re targeting initially. We think that’s a really good size for a country. You know, decent population in Europe. That’s probably be good for one country. You know, when you start thinking about China or Japan or Thailand, in Asia, you can go much bigger because there’s a lot more people living in smaller area, you know, denser populations. And so, you can grow that through higher capacity facilities. What our first three flagship projects, we have one in Quebec, one in France and one in South Korea. And those are all up to 70,000 tons of capacity per year. The unit economics, you know, revenue from a facility like that is generally about 150 to $170 million in revenue. The costs are broken down where you have about feed stock, about 40% of your costs are feed stock related. So, the waste plastic coming in, you have a conversion cost about 30% of your costs are strictly conversion costs. So, the energy and the catalyst and everything it takes to transform the waste into brand new plastic, and then another 30% fixed cost, which is generally labor. So, you know, you’re looking at somewhere, you know, margin somewhere north of 45% EBITDA margins for a project like that.
Michael Kesslering: And obviously a bit of margins, 45% are fantastic. Can you shed a little bit more light on the pricing agreements? How those pricing agreements with your customers work as well as the value proposition from their side and some of the unit economics from their perspective as well?
Daniel Solomita: So, like I said, the pricing contract start with a waste plastic formula. So today there’s an index for waste water bottles. So, when the waste management companies collect move in, they sort out most of the water bottles, some of the water bottle and they sell those water bottles in a bale. And so, there’s an index on what that costs cents per pound. So, we use that as a starting price. And then out of the bail, you see how much of the bail is PETs. So, there’s a conversion in there. Plus, we add a Loop conversion cost to it to get to the final sales price. So today in North America, sales prices, somewhere around 21.50 U.S. dollars a ton for the plastic. Unit economics for brand owner, such as, let’s say a water bottle company like Evian, it’s less than half a penny per bottle, let’s say increase that you’d have to pay over Virgin petroleum base.
So, it’s not a tremendous amount of costs that goes to the consumer. If you want it to charge back to the consumer at the end of the day. The value proposition for them, it’s A, they get Virgin quality. So, petroleum-based quality material. So, the best quality coming from a hundred percent recycled content. So that’s really the value proposition that they get. The quality a hundred percent recycled content, which is very hard for them to do today with mechanical recycling. Today, what they do is, they take the mechanical recycling and they blend it with the petroleum base. Usually, they get somewhere between 15 to 20, 25% recycled content, but as more and more governments start mandating more recycled content, they need to find a better solution. And so that’s really the value proposition for them. And right now, there’s not enough material in the market. So being able to recycle stuff like carpets and clothing provides a new dimension where now there’s going to be more and more recycling available and more material available on the marketplace. So that’s really the key to what we deliver for the customer.
Julian Klymochko: Plus, there’s the intangible benefit of, you know, being environmentally friendly and lowering the pollution levels. So that is obviously a great story that those brands can tell to their customers and assist them with marketing and meeting their ESG goals and things of that nature. So, during my research on Loop, I did come across the negative report released by short seller Hindenburg Research on the company. They posited that Loop will never generate any revenue. I want you to discuss your growth plans and address their criticism?
Daniel Solomita: Yeah, so, Hindenburg came out with a shore report last year, all complete bullshit. I mean, at the end of the day, none of it was all false, all fabricated. They never visited the facility. They don’t know anything about our technology. It was purely motivated to take a shot at Loop stock, make a drop so that they can benefit because they’re a short seller, right?
Julian Klymochko: Right.
Daniel Solomita: They’re selling shares that they don’t own at a price, which if you think about it, it’s crazy. Is there anything else in the world that we can sell something that we don’t own? We can’t sell a house if we don’t own it, we can’t sell a car if we don’t own it. Well, you could sell a stock if you don’t own it.
Julian Klymochko: Right.
Daniel Solomita: And then you can manipulate the market to drive down the price of that stock and buy it cheaply to profit off it. So, it’s a complete completely ludicrous what they let short sellers do. And to be able to do this in the marketplace, it’s just criminal, to be honest with you, that’s my thoughts about it. But you know, that was last year. We proved them obviously wrong by that. Our stock prices trading well above the price when they put out that bogus report against us. Since then, we’ve signed SK Global Chemical. One of the largest chemical companies in the world from South Korea. Bought 10% of Loop at a premium price. We’ve developed partnership with them to build our technology across Asia. We signed a partnership with Suez, the large French waste management company to develop our first project in France. And most recently we just produced our first commercial volumes of resin for Evian, which is going to be generating revenue from us, even from our small facility here in Terrebonne. So I think all of those things put together kind of put Hindenburg thesis to bed. Actually, if you look at the short seller, they’ve come down where I think at the height, they were about 4 million shares short. Today they’re like 2.8 million shares. So, they’ve covered about 2.2 million shares. The stock dropped about five bucks. So, I would say, you know, profit somewhere in the $10 million range, but putting out that bogus report. So, I guess that’s their business model and they have to live with it. But it is what it is, you know, at the end of the day, the technology speaks for itself, our partners speak for itself and, you know, it’s an exciting time for us because, you know, very soon we’re going to be expanding on multiple continents, having production in Europe, North America, and Asia, to be able to supply these global brand companies with materials really exciting. Polyester fiber right now is like, we’re not even talking about that, but the polyester fiber market is so huge. And that’s why the partnership with SK Global Chemical, which changes name to SK Geo Centric is so important because all of our clothes, all of our shoes are manufactured in Asia right now.
Julian Klymochko: Right.
Daniel Solomita: And so, to be able to recycle polyester fiber, either into a water bottle or back into a new fiber is such a tremendous market opportunity that we definitely see Asia being the largest growth market for us. So, the first facility is going to be an Olsen, South Korea South Korea, and we’re going to be breaking ground on that facility in Q1 of 2023. And then we have Vietnam, China, Japan coming up very quickly after that. So huge expansion plans for us in Asia and the partnership with SK really has every single element, a technology company, industrial technology could ever want. It has a strong strategic partner who has, you know the financing capability to execute on multiple projects.
They run chemical plants around the world, so they do all of the operations. So, they’re a fantastic partner and Loop gets a licensing feedback. We own a part of the facility, but also we get paid a licensing feedback. So, you know, our future, as far as revenue, not only do we get money from selling [Inaudible 00:29:26] to the customers, but we also get a licensing feedback from our partners. So same thing form South Korea, Europe and in Quebec where we have our first flagship project here in Canada, to help Canada meet its targets, you know, by 2030, they put two targets, end plastic waste and to have 50% recycled content in Canada. So, you know, having a facility here in Canada to supply the marketplace with recycled content is going to be important. You know, hopefully once we do Quebec, we can do one out west to support the Western Canada.
Julian Klymochko: Yeah, and certainly it’s easy to see the macro tailwinds behind the recycling story, right? That’s super simple to see. It’s a massive problem globally in terms of plastic waste. So, we need to get better with that. So, kudos to you in terms of, you know, attacking that problem with really unique technology and with respect to short reports, see them often on companies and the best way to basically fight back is to execute. And it looks like you guys are executing. So, congrats on the partnerships with SK, Evian. It looks like things are going great at Loop. So, investors, if you’re interested, ticker super easy to remember, LOOP on the NASDAQ exchange. So, Daniel, I’d like to thank you for sharing your story and the opportunity at Loop industries. Super cool what you’re up too, and we’ll be watching the story and wish you the best of luck.
Daniel Solomita: Fantastic, thanks a lot, guys, have a good day.
Julian Klymochko: All right. You as well. Bye everybody.
Daniel Solomita: Great.
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